Breaking down boundaries and barriers - Judith Valerie Engel

You are a concert pianist, pedagogue, musicologist & feminist. In your research at Oxford, you focus on the Viennese composer Marianna Martines, with particular attention to socio-political factors that helped and hindered a ‘classical’ female composer. You are also looking at the musical agency of women in European salon culture. What exactly do you mean by this and how did these areas of interest come about?

I am working on two doctorates, and I am about to complete a doctorate in historical musicology at Oxford. After the Mozarteum, I first went to Vancouver to do a PhD in Musical Arts in Piano Performance. This programme is currently on hold, but I would like to resume and complete it after my doctorate in Oxford. Both doctorates are dedicated to female composers, but in very different ways in different eras. My doctorate in Oxford focuses on the composer, pianist, salonnière and pedagogue Marianna Martines, who lived in Vienna from 1744 to 1812. In a way, I owe this research topic to the Mozarteum and the people involved at the Mozarteum, because in 2014 I performed the Salzburg premiere of Martines' piano concerto at the suggestion of Ms Gertraud Steinkogler-Wurzinger. She was a great mentor and had a very positive influence on my career. Of course, you get fantastic instrumental lessons at the Mozarteum and I am very grateful to Prof Pavel Gililov that I was able to develop my technical skills. I have Gertraud to thank for encouraging my latent and ever-growing interest in women in music. This developed into my desire and realisation of the need to do more research on women composers. In the last four years at Oxford, I also realised more and more how much still needs to be done. Of course, there are already some who are dedicated to this field and doing high quality work both academically and artistically, and that's great, but we haven't yet reached the critical mass where everyone has understood that women have contributed significantly to musical life at all times throughout history. And that it's a false narrative to see a few individuals we've labelled as geniuses as the sole creators of music history. The more research I do, the more interesting women - composers, performers, organisers - I discover. Sometimes it almost makes me angry that I had to work so hard to get to know these women. However, I hope that through my work I make it a little easier for those who come after me. It's incredibly rewarding to get to know a wider range of music and ways of making music. I am focussing my doctoral research at Oxford on 18th and early 19th century European women. My PhD at UBC is dedicated to contemporary Canadian women composers. It still doesn't cover the topic of diversity intersectionally, but you can't do everything and that's my current niche. I think music becomes even more interesting when you know all these women. Unfortunately, in some concert programmes it still feels more like a compulsory exercise when works by female composers are also performed. While large symphonic works by male composers are played, female composers often only perform a short solo work, which is usually in no way representative of their artistic output.

Can you give us a little insight into your research work? Were there any particular ‘aha moments’?

There were a few aha moments (laughs). One of my big concerns is that we don't look at women in music history through androcentric perspectives. How we evaluate and measure success and careers in music history needs to be seen in a more differentiated way. People often ask why this or that female composer didn't publish more or the female pianist didn't play more public concerts, but that's a wrong approach because there were different standards for women and men. A male artistic career in the 18th century was not necessarily what women from the upper middle class or lower aristocracy aspired to or could aspire to because there were social restrictions. Playing public concerts could jeopardise the social position of these women. That's why they didn't do it. They most probably didn't want to for social reasons. But we must not interpret this today as if it were a failure and as if women had not played well enough to perform in public.

Why is gender and feminism research in music important?

For many reasons. I think dealing with history is a politically and socially important topic, and music history is also part of this. Our cultural history and our cultural identity are very closely linked. If the history of music was written in a marginalising way, this naturally has an impact on the here and now. For me, it was interesting to discover the documents of the 18th century, also about the self-experience of women from this period. Feminist historiography or the documentation of ‘first-wave’ and ‘second-wave’ feminists (note: in the 18th and 19th centuries, there was a strong focus on suffrage and equal rights) often only starts in the 19th century. I often had the feeling in discourses that women from earlier centuries were portrayed as victims of oppression, or as unintelligent and immature beings who surrendered to their fate, which of course is not true. It is therefore very interesting to read documents from this period in which women themselves address these grievances and inequalities and describe how the unequal treatment of women and men occurred in certain areas of life. This is relevant because it changes or must change our understanding of the development of gender-sensitive thinking today. The history of feminism is much longer than we generally think. Representation is of course always important. If we don't bring greater diversity into our concert programmes, we can only attract a certain audience to concerts over time. I realise this myself as a pianist. For example, I like to give lecture concerts, which very often remove barriers for new concertgoers who have had little contact with classical music before. By explaining the works a little and giving the historical background, you make them more accessible. My concert programmes are very broadly structured, especially when it comes to the representation of women. This is very well received, even by younger visitors who haven't been to many concerts before. I believe that we need to do a lot in this respect in the future, also in the interests of the concert business.

In your experience, does this also apply to new, atypical venues in order to attract new audiences? How do you deal with this?

With a piano, it's not easy to change venues. For me, the aim is rather to construct settings that don't reflect the typical rituals of the classical concert business. I go back to the old traditions, such as salon culture, on a small scale, where a dialogue with the audience is planned and a very close relationship with the audience is created. Interaction with the audience is also possible and encouraged. At one concert, for example, I really enjoyed the fact that visitors asked questions in between. It almost turned into a conversation - which is atypical for a classical concert. It also breaks down boundaries and barriers.

Pianist and musicologist, that sounds like a balancing act. Where will the journey take you?

I see great potential in the symbiosis of the two fields. Of course, it's not practised that often. The prime example for me is Paul Badura-Skoda, who was also an important mentor for me for many years. I believe that even if it is exhausting, it is worth it. I see a great enrichment for my work and in recent years I have observed an increasing interest in areas such as Artistic Research. It is also increasingly being recognised in the academic field that a methodical approach from the performance side can bring added value to academic work.

In recent years you have been in Salzburg, Vienna, Helsinki, Vancouver and currently in Oxford. Do you see differences between the regions and countries in dealing with the topic of gender and feminism in music?

Definitely, yes. The biggest surprise for me in Vancouver after the Mozarteum was the choice of genres. The Mozarteum is a stronghold of classical music. There was a small competition at the university in Vancouver, which I luckily won in my instrument, but I was asked why I had only chosen classical repertoire and not, for example, a pop song by Lady Gaga. That was very eye-opening for me. Just as we have to realise that it wasn't just the few male geniuses who wrote valuable music, it's not just classical music that is valuable and should be engaged with. I'll probably stay in classical music because it's very time-consuming to engage with music on such a deep level, but I've realised that I also need to work on myself and rethink my values. So it was a very healthy exercise.

A lot of work is currently being done in Oxford to come to terms with the colonial era, and not just in the field of music. Gender is also an issue; there are repeated calls for reading lists to be scrutinised to ensure that enough female authors are represented and that students are not only presented with European men in terms of content. Colonial history and Western classical music are being reconsidered and revised. There are different opinions here too - like everywhere else. I have the feeling that the young students are bringing a breath of fresh air to the universities. The subject areas that young students are interested in are becoming increasingly diverse. Some wonder, for example, why they have to learn composition and ‘classical’ music theory just because it has always traditionally been part of the curriculum. I think you have to take a differentiated view, as you often don't immediately recognise what knowledge and musical tools can be useful for. But rethinking and questioning norms is always a good thing.  

What has changed for women in music in recent years? What still needs to happen?

From my personal experience, I see that classical music still has many conservative corners, especially when it comes to working women. I myself have had some incredible experiences in this regard. During my studies in Austria, I was actually told that as a woman I didn't have to worry too much about my career and that it wasn't so bad if I didn't earn as much because I wasn't a man who had to support a family. If I hadn't experienced it myself, I wouldn't believe it. There really are different standards between the sexes, not just in terms of pay, but also when it comes to arranging concerts. If someone is in a position of power and has the opportunity to support young artists and then doesn't believe that women need to work on their careers, this automatically leads to discrimination. There is still a lot of catching up to do here. It is still difficult for women to reconcile their private life with a professional musical life. I don't know if I have a quick and good solution to the problem, but it certainly needs to be worked on. I believe that our individual attitudes to this issue are crucial if we want to try to create a fairer working world that functions independently of gender discrimination.

What advice would you give your younger self? 

To persevere on the path and to trust that the path is the right one, even if it is sometimes difficult. Also that turning to female composers, even though it was very contrary to my pianistic training, is the right decision for me. The courage to take a step off the beaten track and the certainty that this step is worth it - that's what I would tell my younger self. Everything you do with passion and heart will lead somewhere. You can't always predict where something will lead, but you should trust your gut feeling and intuition.

What is the best thing about your job and what are the downsides?

It's always special for me when I discover new pieces by female composers and am almost blown away by the beauty of the music. Some of the pieces I currently have in my repertoire were often performed in my concerts for the first time in this century. The interaction with other people who are passionate about this subject is also very enriching. It is very fulfilling to be able to share my passion with others.

What are your wishes for the future?

Greater diversity in music and, as a result, growing enjoyment of the diversity of music.

How would you describe your instrument if you had to introduce it as a friend? 

It would be a very emotionally intelligent being. Emotionally sensitive and empathetic.

Is there anything else you would like to tell us?

What I am very grateful for at the Mozarteum is the appreciation of music and the firm conviction that it is worth engaging with music. We're not developing a new vaccine or any obvious survival essentials, but that doesn't mean that our work isn't important. In the long term, it is necessary that we engage with music, make it sound and continue to research it. Internationally, I am often concerned that some universities and artistic organisations are cutting funding for music. In England, for example, some music departments have been completely closed. I think it is incredibly important to engage with music and to cultivate music. Music makes life more worth living and shapes our cultural identity.